Channel4 animal program on tonight 9PM

[VeganD]

Animal Farm 9PM C4

http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/A/animal_farm/index.html

[Gliondrach]

I'll watch it. Thanks.

On BBC2, in The Trap: What Happened To Our Dreams Of Freedom? amongst other things, they said that normal human reactions and emotions were turned into diseases and the drug companies offerred drugs to treat all the suffering people. How nice of them. It all tied in with political/ecomonic attempts to use mathematics in everday life. One consequence was that questionnaires were used in diagnosis. The reasons for certain emotions weren't taken into account. So, if someone felt sad in the previous week or anxious, a tick would be put on a list. If enough ticks were entered the person would be said to be suffering from some mental condition. Everyone feels sad, nervous, restless at some time. But they don't need medication.

The third and last part is next week at 9pm.

[veggiesosage]

I saw that programme. I have to say that I have mixed feelings about some of the points it made. It clearly demonstrated the hyper rationalist managerialist approach that seems to have pervaded all public life which can often seem cold and emotionless.

However, the system that existed before was largely one of 'professionals' exercising their 'professional judgement' so it often depended which professional you got on the day and what sort of mood he (and it was usually he) was in.

Having recently been put through a simple checklist by my GP for depression and having read about them before they're not quite so crude as to class someone who is just going through a bad patch as depresed, it does ask questions about the longer term etc and scores you in bands. If you're someone who's just had a bad couple of days you won't even be placed in the lowest band of depression. However, they are a fairly blunt tool and should only be used as an aid to judgement. Whats a problem is that the social security system uses a questionnaire system to decide whether you are incapapble of work and therefore entitled to sickness benefits. This has a fixed cut off ie if you have mental health problems and you score 9 points you don't get benefit but if you score 10 then you do. Thats slightly barmy.

The most depressing aspect I found was that an underlying assumption behind this new way of thnking was that people only acted in their own self interests so the only means of making the public services work was to somehow tap into public servants self interests. I refuse to acept that this is true. People do a good job at work for a complex variety of reasons, some of which definitely do count as self interest eg wages but many people are strongly motivated by the fact that they've done a good job and made a difference.

[Gliondrach]

I'm glad you have a GP who seems to know what it's doing. But I've read some comments from medical-types who complain about the rise in prescribing drugs for mild depression or depressive periods/interludes. And then there're the studies which say that the drugs are no better than placebo for mild and, I think, moderate depression. I think a lot of progressive GPs suggest exercise for mild depression before they reach for the prescription pad.

About the SS - a near-ish neighbour of mine has been on the sick for years. He just tells his GP that he's depressed and he gets away with it. Of course, he says all the right things about feeling worthless, sleep disturbance, a loss of interest in just about everything. When he went for his latest six-month review, he wore old, dirty, smelly clothes and hadn't shaved for days. He also complains of leg pains, just to make sure. He's very creative. Mind you, he's as daft as a brush.

I didn't see all of that programme as I was falling asleep ( up at 5 am after 3 hours sleep) so I'm not sure what they said about targets but in a couple of jobs I've been in everyone was cutting corners and not doing the job properly to make sure they met their targets. I was just there temporarily and didn't care about targets. There was no way to do the job properly and also reach the targets. I was always at the bottom of the league tables.

Incidently, a different topic I think but Whistleblower on BBC1 today at 9pm has undercover people in bank call centres. They report that customers are lied to and misled. I'll watch that and record the one on Channel 4.

[Fauxmage]

he's as daft as a brush.


What does that mean? It reminds me of something my Gramma used to say about people who smoked. "She smokes like a fish!" :lol: I used to have to remind her "No Gramma. Thats 'smokes like a chimney, drinks like a fish.'"

[veggiesosage]

I think its just a bit of a play on that idea, making a bit of a joke about the total lack of connection between brushes and daftness.

One of my friends used to say that people 'were mad as badgers' in a similar vein.

[Gliondrach]

Yes, it just means that someone is daft.

[veggiesosage]

Its a UK thing :D

[Fauxmage]

How ...... daft. :whistle:

[veggiesosage]

.....as a brush :D

[Fauxmage]

Whatever you say, Mr Sosage. :lol:

[AutomaticMan]

It's funny how I've never really thought how stupid some of the idioms we say are! Something like daft as a brush most sound absurd to folk from other countries. Crazy!

[thevegantwins]

Here's some for our UK and :updn: brethren:

Shit on a shingle
Crazy as a loon
Colder than a witch's tit
Uglier than sin

[Gliondrach]

We say As ugly as sin.

What about 'As thick as two short planks'? Someone who is not very intelligent.

Back on topic - I saw the Animal Farm thing. Featherless chickens that can be farmed in hot countries so that they can stay cool. Pigs with a jellyfish gene that makes them glow green under a special light. They will be used in medical research. There was also a type of rice that contains beta carotene. This is to try to prevent the thousands of deaths each year from vitamin A deficiency in countries where the main diet is mostly of rice. A laudable aim but I'm not sure if it would be safe. Once these unaturally-occurring genes get into the wild anything could happen. The scientist on the programme sees nothing wrong in all this. She said that farmers have been selectively breeding animals and plants for millennia. Yes, two sheep or two cabbages together - as could happen naturally. Not putting fish genes into tomatoes or human genes into non-humans.

http://www.boing boing.net/2006/01/12/greenglowing_pigs.html