Conversation at Whole Foods

[Cherie]

So today at Whole Foods, a person in the tofu/juice/milk/eggs/yogurt section asked me if I was vegan (I just asked what happend to the Vegan Gourmet and they had to go in the back to get it) and I said yes. He said he was an omnivore and wanted to know what I thought of their new placement of products.

It used to be all veggie stuff in one section, but now it was a "breakfast" section with pig bacon and other meaty stuff right in the shelf below the tofu. I told him that I was looking at the tofu shelf and my eyes shifted down and I was shocked to see real bacon there, a little grossed out, but that it wouldn't stop me from buying tofu, and that I had knowledge that Whole Foods sold meat and I guessed it was their choice to do so.

He said that he got chewed out for 45 min. on the phone one time for Whole Foods carrying meat products. I told him maybe people were surprised, since the CEO is a vegan. he told me Mackey eats eggs but keeps his own chickens. (whatever, not really pertinent, i guess).

I said that hfs's in Indiana were more geared toward vegetarians, since there were so many other stores, but that this particular WF is centrally-located and a lot of people come their for groceries. (I was basically trying to take the position that it's a business decision for them to carry meat and trying to APPEAR non-judgmental, since he already had an experience with what he thought was a judgmental vegan. that said, i wnated to end the conversation soon, before I said something "judgmentally" perceived. )

Anyway, he said he was surprised that the sight of meat would bother me. I explained that I don't really see it as meat or food, but I love animals and I really think of the pig when I see the "bacon." He said he loved animals, he has dogs, is a breeder (hahah!!!), and his wife grooms animals. he asked me if I knew that WF has a compassionate standards policy or something and that there are no federal policies in place. I said that I didn't know that about WF but that I knew there were no federal standards.

He said something about free-range, cage-free, blah-blah. I told him I thought it was better, but not good. He said well, if they're going to raise animals, it's best to do it that way. I asked him if he thought it was okay to kill a child if he thought that child had been free-range and "happy" for 10 years. He paused and said, "Well, that's not fair." I said, "Well, the world isn't fair." (I wasn't about to go on, just wanted to let him think about that and not even harass him about breeding). He thanked me for giving my opinion and said they will remove the meat after the holidays.

I also gave a comment card to the produce department today, asking them to remove the cheese from the fresh fruit and vegetable department, that it smelled and was gag-worthy. Don't know what kind it was, but I seriously choked before I saw what it was that smelled.

So do you think I handled it okay? Obviously, in this case, I had to be gentle and not give too much "information" or too much of my thoughts about what a hypocrite he was.

:whistle: :male:

[Cherie]

Oh, after I said, "Well, teh world isn't fair," I said, "We can agree to disagree."

[Oracl]

So do you think I handled it okay? Obviously, in this case, I had to be gentle and not give too much "information" or too much of my thoughts about what a hypocrite he was. :whistle: :male:
I think you did a very good job, staying calm and logical at all times. :agree: You are more likely to make him think about things through this approach than if you had become emotional, even if you feel very emotional in the face of so many corpses and smelly secretions!! :( Well done! :thumbsup:

[Bowwowmeow]

It sounds like you handled things well, Cherie. It is odd to me that the CEO is vegan, or semi-vegan, and they still sell dead animals, but I realize they probably couldn't grow their business to the level its at without it. I do appreciate the vegan stuff they sell there, which is the only place I can get some things, unless I want to order them from online. Its nice to be able to walk into a store and get stuff like vegan lip balm and soy whipped cream.

But they do some weird things. Several months ago I became aware of a campaign to get them to stop keeping live lobsters in tanks for sale. I have such blinders on when I go near the dead animal sections of any store I never even saw the tanks! :mad: Now they are gone though. :yea:But mine stock the smelliest cheeses in the produce section too. You'e wandering through, enjoying the fresh berries and ripe tomatoes, and you turn a corner and get a whiff of old socks and dirty diapers! :blecch: It doesn't put me off getting the produce I need, but its gross, and it always makes me wonder why people find that stuff appealing. :confused: I get asked if I am a vegetarian sometimes, but only by people who are trying to go veggie themselves, so I've never had a conversation quite like you did. I will tell people I won't eat anything I can be friends with, and I can be friends with anything, and they never seem to get upset about this. I'd like to be more militant, but I'm not sure it would do any good. :o

[Cherie]

Yeah, I think we have to pick and choose when to be "militant" and shout things like "meat is murder." :D

[Phoenix]

So do you think I handled it okay? Obviously, in this case, I had to be gentle and not give too much "information" or too much of my thoughts about what a hypocrite he was.
Sounds like you handled the whole situation really well. :)

I can appreciate the problem because there is only one decent supermarket in my town, and they have it set up in such a way that the customers can only reach the fruit & veggies by walking past the cadavers first.

I did fight - and win - a one woman campaign against their live lobster tank a few years ago though.

[Cherie]

i was in an asian market one time and there were live fish in a tank, that i guess the person who bought them brought the fish home and killed them? it made me tear up and get dizzy. i can't imagine ever being an omni again.

[Gliondrach]

You handled things nicely, Cherie. You have to choose your approach with each person. You can be more outspoken with people you know but you will just put strangers' backs up if you lecture them. Of course, if you don't care what they think, you can just let them have it full blast.

Phoenix, well done!

[Keykeypie]

I did fight - and win - a one woman campaign against their live lobster tank a few years ago though.

WOW....GOOD JOB PHOENIX!

Cherie....I think you showed remarkable restraint.....I really admire that.
You left him with some things to think about....

I mean at times like that do you ever feel like you're on a hidden camera
show?....and the object is to get you to lose your temper.....like the person
you're speaking with is secretly being coached......

Like....make sure she knows you're NOT a vegetarian or anything like that.
( hum.....no response)

Ok she's a cool one...let's try,
......tell her you're surprised that the sight of meat would bother her.
[Humm.....she's still not reacting]


Say you're an animal lover........she won't be able to resist pointing out
what a bloody hypocrate you are.
[Damm! She's a tough one!]

OK.....OK......I got it.....this get's em every time. Tell her you breed dogs.

But good for you Cherie......keeping your cool can never be a bad thing.

But really.....can anybody understand stuff like this? It seems like you
really just wanted to get away from him and get on with what you were doing
but he kept bugging you.
Was he trying to come-on to you? That's what it sounds like, but then
why mention a wife? He said he'd already been chewed out over them carrying
meat....was he looking for more punishment?
Anybody here a psycoligist....right, I don't even know how to spell it...but still....what's up with people like that guy?

[Cherie]

hmm, he was much older than i am but that didn't stop the guy at the car dealership the other day...that's another topic, though. some people seem to not respect their spouses or commitments very well!

you know, what you wrote is so funny, because it is like he was trying to say something to upset me, and i know i had to get home before the laundry stopped (i use coin-operated; it's in teh building, but i don't want to leave it sitting and have someone else touch my laundry), so i kept looking like i wanted to get on with what i was doing.

i don't know. it could have been planned and/or he could have been trying to get a reaction from me.

[thevegantwins]

:agree: I think you handled it well too.

Trader Joe's is odd like that too. They used to keep their tofu and other soy products except soy milk, soy yogurt and earth balance, with the dead animals. I complained several times and they listened but said that they wanted the tofu with the dead animal since they considered it an entree like dead animal. When I went last week, I noticed the tofu was moved to below the soymilk but they kept the baked tofu, tofu burgers and other vegan meat analogs with the dead animal. I asked them what the logic behind that was and no one had an answer.

[Keykeypie]

hmm, he was much older than i am but that didn't stop the guy at the car dealership the other day.

OK......got the picture. Now it makes sense. :agree:

You're an attractive young lady......mystery solved.:blinkwave:

[Oracl]

I did fight - and win - a one woman campaign against their live lobster tank a few years ago though.
Good for you, Phoenix! :thumbsup: :yea: :cheer:

[Bowwowmeow]

:agree: I think you handled it well too.

Trader Joe's is odd like that too. They used to keep their tofu and other soy products except soy milk, soy yogurt and earth balance, with the dead animals. I complained several times and they listened but said that they wanted the tofu with the dead animal since they considered it an entree like dead animal. When I went last week, I noticed the tofu was moved to below the soymilk but they kept the baked tofu, tofu burgers and other vegan meat analogs with the dead animal. I asked them what the logic behind that was and no one had an answer.
I'm wondering if it isn't a good idea to have it with the dead animals after all. We want people to stop eating animals, and having tofu and other protein rich foods right there makes them visible to people who might not otherwise seek them out. Even if they don't try them, it mainstreams the products in a way that they would not otherwise enjoy if they were tucked away in a special food section. I know my dad and stepmom buy Gardenburgers and Boca Burgers, and they are coming to prefer them to beef. This is not because of me, because I rarely eat either, and I never push stuff on my family. So I think its mainly because these items are becoming more visible, and they are recognized as healthy alternatives to dead animals, rather than foods designed for and marketed to "faddists". I don't like haivng to be confronted with dead animal parts when I shop for food, but I am willing to accept it if it will make even one person a month try a tofu weenie instead of a dead animal one.

[Oracl]

We want people to stop eating animals, and having tofu and other protein rich foods right there makes them visible to people who might not otherwise seek them out. Even if they don't try them, it mainstreams the products in a way that they would not otherwise enjoy if they were tucked away in a special food section.
Good point. :rubchin: :agree:

[Soynut]

Cherie, I think it looks like you handled that really well. I tend to get emotional when confronted (like you actually were), and I kind of choke up... and it's so personal and important to me, that I find it difficult to put the whole concept of veganism in a few words to a stranger. Good job!:)

[Phoenix]

... I mean at times like that do you ever feel like you're on a hidden camera show?....and the object is to get you to lose your temper.....like the person you're speaking with is secretly being coached......

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[KRITER]

You dun good Cherie